N73 on tmobile wont work on 3g

[double_zero]

hi, i have just purchased a nokia n73 on t-mobile pay and go tariff for £100 (had to buy a £20 topup also) and it had 10 days unlimited web access, its been working fine as a modem for my pc even connects to 3g network but its started dropping connection back to standard t-mob gsm network for no good reason when its hooked to pc or not.
ive phoned customer services and they said there shouldnt be a problem with 3g in my area stating its at 95% signal strength and i dont abuse the service downloading huge files so was wondering if anyone could help solve the problem.

could it be a problem with the phone or is it network?

[lawbunny]

Hey, could be either.

Pop your sim card in another 3G T-Mobile phone (ie if your friend has one) in the same area. If the problem persists it's either your sim or the network. If the problem does not persist in the otehr phone then it's a phone fault.

Although customer services say their system shows strong 3G signal in your area, there are black spots, and the signal can be weakened depending on what kind of building you are in and your exact location.

[Orange Primate]

do t-mobile do 3g on PAYG? last i heard they didnt do 3g at all on PAYG

[DaveC]

do t-mobile do 3g on PAYG? last i heard they didnt do 3g at all on PAYG

They have done it for over a year now.

[Planner]

if its starting on 3G then dropping to 2G, It sounds like either your RSCP is too low, OR, there are capacity issues.

alternatively, they could just have loaded a new set of parameters onto the network changing the HHO threshold.

[double_zero]

its working fine now must have been due to the fact it was a free unlimited web n walk 10 day addon for new customers.
i now pay £2.50 for 5 days unlimited browsing on the 3g network kicks ass when hooked to pc im getting speeds of 60kbps when downloading using a accelerator.

thanks for your help.

yes you can get 3g on pay as you go i have it on my n73 works amazing.:)

[Neil201]

I recently got a PAYG T-Mob SIM as my Mum wants to end her contract with Three and as she's leaving the country for a couple of Months, decided to port in to a PAYG SIM so she won't loose her No for when she's back.

I choose T-Mob purely for curiosity to see exactly how their coverage faired up with other networks as they are the only one I've never used and have always been very sceptical about their level of service in this respect.

I can confirm 3G works on PAYG but the handover threshold appears to be very high. At home, when walking around the house, I got -70dBm on 3G (full s-points on the signal meter) but it handed over to 2G which dropped to an average level of -95dBm and wasn't too hot (average 2/10 on the signal meter). Also driving down the motorway around Manchester it seems to constantly swap between 2G and 3G despite there being good 3G coverage all the way.

[Planner]

threshold for HHO is likely to be somewhere between -105 and -109. certainly no better than -100 or the system wouldnt work properly.

what sort of phone are you using?

[Neil201]

It's a Nokia 6680, quite old compared to some of the newer models. When I had a VF SIM in it, the handover seemed lower and it stays on 3G longer so presume their HHO is lower than T-Mob's?

The UMTS RF front-end in the newer N series phones seems better too as in terms of basic signal strength on the s-meter, I'm getting a higher signal than the 6680 both when I did comparisons for Three, VF and T-Mobile. Then again, I suppose you don't know what the calibration is like for the later phones and I can't get this Celltrack symbian software to run on the N series device (as there's some certification issue when installing it that I need to get my head around) so can't see a proper signal level in dBm.

[Planner]

the 6680 is quite dire fro ma radio point of view.

its reciever sensitivity sucks, and on 2G will die @ approx -100dBm or an RX Qual of 6. an ericsson for example will give you 6-10 db better performance.

it is possible that t-mobile would use a lower threshold than VF, possibly due to the fact they use 1800 GSM.. but im not entirely sure. it seems to kind of defeat the purpose.. certainly to force HHO below -100.

the only thing i can suggest is that the HHO isnt just RSCP based, but EC/Io based... ie, if all code interference hits -xxdBm, then it forces HHO. too many scrambling codes in one area basically....

[PeteMc]

For those of us who don't work for mobile companies, what does HHO, RSCP and EC/Io represent?

[Planner]

sorry.

HHO hard handover- 3g-2g hando over
RSCP basically your effective signal level. this is not what the phone shows.
Ec/Io.. noise/ interference

[Neil201]

the 6680 is quite dire fro ma radio point of view.

its reciever sensitivity sucks, and on 2G will die @ approx -100dBm or an RX Qual of 6. an ericsson for example will give you 6-10 db better performance.

it is possible that t-mobile would use a lower threshold than VF, possibly due to the fact they use 1800 GSM.. but im not entirely sure. it seems to kind of defeat the purpose.. certainly to force HHO below -100.

the only thing i can suggest is that the HHO isnt just RSCP based, but EC/Io based... ie, if all code interference hits -xxdBm, then it forces HHO. too many scrambling codes in one area basically....

Your right that the 2G capabilities of the 6680 aren't up to much. I had one of these on Three for 18 Months and when mostly on 3G it was ok, 2G reception never really cut the mustard too much. The N73 is better both for 2G and also there's an improvement 3G-wise too.

When I get a minute, I'll have to fire up my Agilent 8590A analyser and see what levels I'm getting on a GSM whip. It's got the frequency upgrade card installed so can measure up and slightly above 1800 MHz (1500 by default). There isn't a lot of difference freq. attenuation wise between 1800 and 1900/2100 MHz so maybe this is why T-Mob have a higher threshold, doesn't make sense though when I'm half a mile from two 3G sites and 1.5 miles from a 3G/2G shared site so possibly like you say it's Ec/Io based too.

On an operators 3G only site, say for example a roadside cabin, would operators generally set a HHO threshold lower than a shared 2G/3G site given that the field strength of the 3G RAN is going to be higher around the area covered by that particular site? I do notice on Vodafone that when the phone is attached to a 3G only site, it does hang on longer as the field strength drops before a HHO occurs.

[buckie]

The last few posts for me and fellow colleagues. helps greatly, the basis being, certain handsets, Will handle the network differently than others.

We can run reports on the overall perfomance of the network as an individual user and also in performance issues, the good thing being, anybody who owns old skool handsets, NOKIA 5146, C15 (yes) and Moto , will know themselves, that there not so great at getting a signal

My best examples for Poor Handover and Poor reception are as follows :- Motorola V(all models), Nokia N (N73,6170), Sony Ericcson (W880i, W950i), Samsung (900, 900i),

All slimline designed handsets have issues

[Neil201]

The last few posts for me and fellow colleagues. helps greatly, the basis being, certain handsets, Will handle the network differently than others.

We can run reports on the overall perfomance of the network as an individual user and also in performance issues, the good thing being, anybody who owns old skool handsets, NOKIA 5146, C15 (yes) and Moto , will know themselves, that there not so great at getting a signal

My best examples for Poor Handover and Poor reception are as follows :- Motorola V(all models), Nokia N (N73,6170), Sony Ericcson (W880i, W950i), Samsung (900, 900i),

All slimline designed handsets have issues

Which handsets in your opinion have a more sensitive front-end? It seems with the Nokia's that they've sacrificed the GSM sensitivity for better UMTS reception. Perhaps they should bring back phones with external antennas!!