Data usage

[digitalscooby]

I've just renewed with Vodafone and received a free N95 (yesterday).

I've taken the £7.50 p/m data package and which I believe allows me 130meg (1st month free).

What is the easiest way to see how much of this I have used at a given point? I've checked my online account and can see the last bill but I can't see anywhere that shows the current position.

Is a record kept anywhere in the phone?

Also, I understand that when I connect through a a wireless network (my home network for example) browsing, downloading pics etc is free. Is it only therefore when I select 'contract internet' as the connection method I begin to eat into my monthly allowance?

Many thanks for any help you can give.

Steve

[voda_retailguy]

hi there

its 120mb for 7.50 p/month, most phones should have some data counter so you can keep track that way. if not alternatively if you call 44555 it will text your phone what you have used. altho there is a 72 hour delay on this info. but you should roughly be able to see where you are at.

[lfcfanuk]

And to answer your second question when using wifi (your home network to connect to the internet) this will be free of charge

[Homer J]

What is the easiest way to see how much of this I have used at a given point?

You can see total data used under log > packet data on the phone.

Set the log duration (under log>settings) to 30 days.

Set a monthly reminder to reset the data log at the start of each month (does not matter when your contract started, vodafone bill by the calendar month).

Otherwise, keep an eye on your unbilled calls, you'll start getting billed when you go over the 120MB :laugh:

[Hopefullyuseful]

Also, I understand that when I connect through a a wireless network (my home network for example) browsing, downloading pics etc is free. Is it only therefore when I select 'contract internet' as the connection method I begin to eat into my monthly allowance?

Many thanks for any help you can give.

Steve

Hi Steve,

I can help you with this. With the £7.50 data pack, yes it is free for the first month and then you start to be charged. The allowance is 120 megabytes per month before reverting to our new daily rate charging once the allowance is used up.

Some phones do have usage counters yes but it depends on the make and model and it is worth checking out how to do it and if it's available on your phone by going to the manufacturers website Nokia here.

Our online billing service that you use will give you unbilled usage information if you click on 'My Bill' and then 'Unbilled calls' on the left hand side.

It is also correct that if you connect using your wireless home network, you won't be charged by Vodafone as you're using your own home connection and not the Vodafone network.

I hope this helps answer your questions Steve.

Hopefullyuseful
Vodafone UK

[Homer J]

Some phones do have usage counters yes but it depends on the make and model and it is worth checking out how to do it and if it's available on your phone by going to the manufacturers website Nokia here.

Or just take the advice of an N95 owner who is on the same data plan. i.e. me.

Our online billing service that you use will give you unbilled usage information if you click on 'My Bill' and then 'Unbilled calls' on the left hand side.

Up to 3 days out of date, when it works at all. ;)

[thetinsnail]

just something i am not sure about this.
i have heard that sometimes if the network has to resend data that didn;t get through properly, or had errors, then that also comes out of your allowance, but may not be counted on your phone (eg if it never even made it to your phone) therefore it would be quite easy to go a bit over your limit even if the phone showed you were ok.
due to the meagre amount of data transfer vodafone supply, most users will probably have to skirt dangerously close to the limit.
it wouldn't take much over the 120 meg limit, before you end up paying just as much for the extra few megs you use than for the initial 120 meg.

i assume this is why vodafone stuck with such a low limit. the bonus payments will make up for the reduced number of people who subscribe.

also the n95 can use a small amount of data to help speed up the gps startup. don't know if this is counted in the data log on the phone (i turned it off on my phone)

[dan_n95]

Any idea it there are any restrictions on the 120MB?

Thanks

[ItziBitzi]

The allowance is 120 megabytes per month before reverting to our new daily rate charging once the allowance is used up.


Once the 120 megabytes allowance is used up it changes to 1 GBP per day with an allowance of 15 megabytes, right? What's the price for a megabyte then?

Also, I am wondering: Do you know as to when this price plan was introduced? I am basically interested to hear if it's been this way to see how likely changes to this plan are. :lick:

[Homer J]

The new data tariff came in at the start of June IIRC.

A Megabyte costs £2 if you go over the 15MB in one day.

[Neil201]

If you subscribe to the £7.50 data pack, does this include data used for email (via the Internet APN?). For example, if I used some of the 120MB allowance or the £1/15MB 'PAYG' daily capped browsing allowance for quick web access or mail using Outlook via a laptop, does this data count too? I'm led to believe only internet access via the Vodafone Live portal is counted towards this £1/day data allowance? Perhaps someone can clarify this for me?

[gembo2609]

Hi Neil,

Thanks for your question. Both the Vodafone £7.50 data pack and the daily rate include email. The data pack allows for 120MB of data usage and the daily rate is £1 for the first 15MB each day and £2 per MB thereafter, this can be used for everything apart from messenger services and VOIP which are always charged at £2 per MB.

For more information please visit the Mobile Internet section of the Vodafone website (http://online.vodafone.co.uk/dispatch/Portal/appmanager/vodafone/wrp?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=templateBlank&pageID=MI_0001)here.

I hope this answers your query for you.

Thanks
Gembo
Vodafone UK

[ardsar]

There seems to be some confusion over whether the 120MB allowance includes chat services such as yahoo or msn. I have an email from Vodafone customer services stating that i am allowed to use MSN within the data allowance. I have used the service and not been charged at £2 MB.

Can someone at vodafone please clarify this - it appears you dont know yourselves.

[techgirl]

There seems to be some confusion over whether the 120MB allowance includes chat services such as yahoo or msn. I have an email from Vodafone customer services stating that i am allowed to use MSN within the data allowance. I have used the service and not been charged at £2 MB.

Can someone at vodafone please clarify this - it appears you dont know yourselves.

In normal circumstances you will be charged for using peer to peer messaging (msn) and Voip at a rate of £2 per MB.

You can use the data pack to:


Browse Vodafone live! pages
Browse pages outside of live! (i.e. bbc.co.uk)
Video streaming from off-net sites
Accessing your email on their phone
Using your phone as a modem


You can see a full list of frequently asked questions relating to the Data package, including the terms of use by visiting the relavant section of our website here. (http://online.vodafone.co.uk/dispatch/Portal/appmanager/vodafone/wrp?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=template10&pageID=MI_0036)

I apologise for the misinformation you have received. if you want to forward the email you have received to us we can look into getting the knowledge up dated. Please fill in Vodafone's online contact Form (https://online.vodafone.co.uk/dispatch/Portal/appmanager/vodafone/wrp?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=Page_Help_ContactUs&pageID=PCU_0002) including the code FIT135 to ensure the email comes to my team.

Any other questions please don't hesitate to ask.

Techgirl
Vodafone UK

[old bill]

Can any of the Vodafone staff tell us if there is any chance that Vodafone will be improving their data packages ? 120 meg will not go far if you are streaming radio or videos.

[ardsar]

Does vodafone have any plans to change this like other mobile phone operators. The data usage is usually fairly low and therefore i cant understand why vodafone do not allow this type of use under the allowance. I can however understand why VOIP is not included.

[Homer J]

In normal circumstances you will be charged for using peer to peer messaging (msn) and Voip at a rate of £2 per MB.

You can use the data pack to:


Browse Vodafone live! pages
Browse pages outside of live! (i.e. bbc.co.uk)
Video streaming from off-net sites
Accessing your email on their phone
Using your phone as a modem



So, if I use MSN or VoIP on my laptop when I'm using my phone as a modem will that be included in the £7.50 data plan?

[techgirl]

Does vodafone have any plans to change this like other mobile phone operators. The data usage is usually fairly low and therefore i cant understand why vodafone do not allow this type of use under the allowance. I can however understand why VOIP is not included.

Can any of the Vodafone staff tell us if there is any chance that Vodafone will be improving their data packages ? 120 meg will not go far if you are streaming radio or videos.

Unfortunately we're not aware of any changes that are due to take place in relation to allowances under the data package. Any announcements will be advertised on the Vodafone website. (http://www.vodafone.co.uk)

So, if I use MSN or VoIP on my laptop when I'm using my phone as a modem will that be included in the £7.50 data plan?

Any use of MSN and VoIP aren't included in the £7.50, this would include when using the phone as a modem. They are charged at the rate of £2 per MB

Any more questions please don't hesitate to ask.

Techgirl
Vodafone UK

[oaklandm]

Just to clarify something on the messenger side of things.. I have the N95 8GB which has the 'vodafone messenger' pre-installed, you can use it to access msn messenger, will the use of this be included in the 120mb? From what I'm reading I'm guessing not but would like to know for definite..

Would be about right for a network to pre-install an application that you can't use in their plans : )

[edwardpeter]

Hi oaklandm,

The Vodafone Messenger service pre-installed in your handset's menu won't go from your inclusive 120MB data bundle, but neither is it charged at £2 per MB. It's actually a subscription service which is completely free until 1st March. From then on it'll be £3 per month with the first month being free.

For the £3 per month charge you can send up to 1000 messages per day. Once you reach this limit, the service would be restricted until 11pm when it's reset and you can start using the service again.

Happy messaging!

edwardpeter
Vodafone UK

[Richdog]

Vodas data charges are appalling, shameful compared to toher networks. I hope they change and get competitive soon...

[oaklandm]

Hi oaklandm,

The Vodafone Messenger service pre-installed in your handset's menu won't go from your inclusive 120MB data bundle, but neither is it charged at £2 per MB. It's actually a subscription service which is completely free until 1st March. From then on it'll be £3 per month with the first month being free.

For the £3 per month charge you can send up to 1000 messages per day. Once you reach this limit, the service would be restricted until 11pm when it's reset and you can start using the service again.

Happy messaging!

edwardpeter
Vodafone UK

Thanks for clearing that up, doesn't sound too bad now..

Richdog, think vodafone are bad? You should try orange, just moved from them and they charge £8 for 30mb per month : (

[JAB1972]

Vodafone are bad, 120M a month, it’s just not enough. Vodafone seem to think that this is a massive amount! It’s 4M a day!!!! This is very easy to exceed with a few emails and a moderate amount of browsing a day (Most feature rich pages are around 200-300k).

Then you will be charged £1 a day until the end of the month (if you go over 500k a day, which will take around 3 web pages!!!!).

Your right Orange are just not in the same decade as far as data usage is concerned £8 for 30M……what a joke!!!!!!

Three and T-mobile have the best data plans at 1Gig and O2 are not too bad at 200M.

Why can’t Vodafone just get in the real world and offer a decent data package even if they charged a bit more, say £10.

It’s a shame as I am currently coming to the end of a t-mobile contract and want to join Vodafone as they are the only network that have solid coverage in my house but I just can’t with such a pathetic data restriction when I am used to having 1Gig with t-mobile. I don’t think that I use anywhere near 1Gig, but I definitely would exceed 120M.

I am currently able to use all the data facilities on my phone with out worry and I want to stay that way.

[emmajg]

There is another data pack for £10 a month which include the 120Mb, MyMail & MSN
I get 100mb included on my staff plan and it's plenty for me.

[old bill]

There is another data pack for £10 a month which include the 120Mb, MyMail & MSN
I get 100mb included on my staff plan and it's plenty for me.
Sorry 100mb pm is not a lot these days. I use on average at least 600mb on my N95 on Orange each month.
There was some talk of a £10 data pack when I upgraded my Vodafone contract a few weeks ago. But they could not find the bundle. What data pack do I need to ask for to get this £10 package ?

[emmajg]

I'll have to check with work if I can put full add-on codes on here. The £7.50 I know has a 1 on the end and the £10 has a 3 so if the customer adviser can put the £7.50 on your account then as long as they change the 1 to a 3 then it should work.

p.s. I admit I don't surf or listen to Internet radio I just get my gmail and do a bit of msn. I'm lucky I'm home in the day time so just use my wifi.
I've installed divx and watched some tv on it last night :)

[old bill]

There is another data pack for £10 a month which include the 120Mb, MyMail & MSN
I get 100mb included on my staff plan and it's plenty for me.
Thanks for the tip. Its now been added on to my account. Vodafone C/S told me that its not for new customers and thats why its not listed on their web site.

[hockeyshooter]

Vodafone did change their data card plans recently - the monthly data allowance went up and the cost went down, so my 250Mb/month @ £30 contract became 3Gb/month @ £25 and I got a 3G/HSDPA USB modem for free. So the handset add-on of £7.50 for 150Mb per month is little bit stingy in comparison.

In terms of data allowance, perhaps they assume that you're only going to be browsing WAP pages (which tend to be deliberately designed to reduce data) or sending/receiving text emails? They certainly don't want you using it for VoIP...

Chris.

[Hopefullyuseful]

Hi all,

Yes to clarify, the data tariffs have been more recently changed for personal users so that the data tariff is now only £15.00 per month for up to 3GB usage. After 3GB there is a charge of £15.00 for each 1Gb over that. You can get more mobile broadband information about this on the Vodafone website here (http://online.vodafone.co.uk/dispatch/Portal/appmanager/vodafone/wrp?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=template04&pageID=MB_0001).

The £7.50 data bundle for mobile users gives 120Mb allowance each month for browsing the internet on their phone and for Live pages too. This is more specific to mobile phone internet on the move and not really related to the way you'd use your USB modem for browsing on a laptop or home PC in a static position.

Hopefullyuseful
Vodafone UK

[old bill]

Hi all,

Yes to clarify, the data tariffs have been more recently changed for personal users so that the data tariff is now only £15.00 per month for up to 3GB usage. After 3GB there is a charge of £15.00 for each 1Gb over that. You can get more mobile broadband information about this on the Vodafone website here (http://online.vodafone.co.uk/dispatch/Portal/appmanager/vodafone/wrp?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=template04&pageID=MB_0001).

The £7.50 data bundle for mobile users gives 120Mb allowance each month for browsing the internet on their phone and for Live pages too. This is more specific to mobile phone internet on the move and not really related to the way you'd use your USB modem for browsing on a laptop or home PC in a static position.

Hopefullyuseful
Vodafone UK

The problem is that 120mb is not a lot when you are downloading videos on to your phone or streaming live radio. When will Vodafone give their customers products that they want ? Decent data packs,MMS Packs,Video calling packs. Come on Vodafone you used to be a good network now you just try and play catch up and you do even that badly.

[emmajg]

Vodafone did change their data card plans recently - the monthly data allowance went up and the cost went down, so my 250Mb/month @ £30 contract became 3Gb/month @ £25 and I got a 3G/HSDPA USB modem for free.

Chris.

The £25 data package on Business Account has now increased it's fair use to 5Gb just in case you didn't know.

As for your other comments on here I can ask if there's any future plans for increasing the data bundles. I personally download large stuff on PC and transfer to mobile

[old bill]

The £25 data package on Business Account has now increased it's fair use to 5Gb just in case you didn't know.

As for your other comments on here I can ask if there's any future plans for increasing the data bundles. I personally download large stuff on PC and transfer to mobile

Vodafone had it so right a few years ago when they did the extras packs which were data/MMS/text. It a great shame they were withdrawn as Vodafone seem to have gone downhill since then. But if the feedback that customers are not happy with price plans can get back to the managers then that would be a starting point. Thanks for your time and help.

[Hughesy]

Hi all,

Yes to clarify, the data tariffs have been more recently changed for personal users so that the data tariff is now only £15.00 per month for up to 3GB usage. After 3GB there is a charge of £15.00 for each 1Gb over that. You can get more mobile broadband information about this on the Vodafone website here (http://online.vodafone.co.uk/dispatch/Portal/appmanager/vodafone/wrp?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=template04&pageID=MB_0001).

The £7.50 data bundle for mobile users gives 120Mb allowance each month for browsing the internet on their phone and for Live pages too. This is more specific to mobile phone internet on the move and not really related to the way you'd use your USB modem for browsing on a laptop or home PC in a static position.

Hopefullyuseful
Vodafone UK

How come the data only tariff is so much cheaper than the add on 120
Mb?
£15 for 3 gig = 0.5 p / Mb
£7.50 for 120 Mb = 6.25 p / Mb <- twelve times more expensive!!

I want to get the £15 tariff on my phone, then just pay for calls and text, it will be cheaper!!

[Homer J]

I want to get the £15 tariff on my phone, then just pay for calls and text, it will be cheaper!!

Elsewhere someone complained of getting premium texts sent to their data card number.

The solution given was to put the SIM from the data card in a phone and send a stop request.

So, although vodafone might not support it, the solution might be to get the data card and put the SIM in a phone.

Not sure if they support voice calls though.

[ricflairandy]

Anyone know how i can get msn working on my n95?

Ive got the internet addon , can it be used out of tht?

[gembo2609]

Hi Ricflairandy,

Hope you're well.

You can access MSN on your mobile from this website here - http://info.mobile.msn.com/en-us/default.aspx in the top right of the screen you have the option to supply your mobile number and they will then send an SMS to your handset providing you with the link to use MSN on your mobile.

You will need to have your content control restriction lifted from your account in order to use the service. If you need this doing please contact us from the Vodafone contact us (http://info.mobile.msn.com/en-us/default.aspx) form here. If you include the code FIT135 in the body of the email it will direct it through to my team. Please answer all the questions on the form so we can access your account and please also give a description of what you need.

In terms of charging, MSN is classed as peer to peer usage and this isn't covered by your internet bundle. For any peer to peer usage you are charged at £2 per MB.

I hope this helps you to get going using MSN on your mobile.

Gembo
Vodafone UK

[AJ145]

I have 7.50 MobInt data bundle 120MB on my contract and since this was added, I am unable to create a VPN connection (pptp) to anything, I am also unable to connect to an IMAPS service. I can connect to anything on port 80, but that's about it. I have tried numerous times but I am unable to speak to anybody at Vodafone Customer Services who understands or who is willing to put the call through to somebody that might understand.

This is where it got strange - when I renewed my contract, I asked for the data package to be included in the next 18 month contract. This wasn't done, and I wasn't aware until I got my first <shocking> bill. But at this point, I could PPTP and I could get mail over IMAPS. I then complained, Vodafone acknowledged the mistake, refunded and applied the MobInt Data Bundle to my contract. Since then I have not been able to make data connections to anything other than port 80 - it seems like it's restricted down to that use only.

Is anybody able to shed any light on what is happening, as I am becoming increasingly frustrated at the Customer Service team not understanding or not trying to understand the problem. I realise it is perhaps a little technical for your general representative to handle but nobody seems willing to try and put the call through to somebody that might know.

[emmajg]

Hi Ricflairandy - ask to have the £10 data pack as this includes the 120Mb, MSN and MyMail

Hi AJ145 - I'll ask my fellow wizards when I'm in work this week and see if they can help. What device are you using?

[AJ145]

Thanks Emma - It's a v1615, I get the same problem directly from the device or when using it as a modem with a laptop. It's almost as if since applying the mob int package the rest of the internet has been firewalled by Vodafone, restricting access to only port 80 (http). This wasn't really what I was expecting from a 120mb data package.

[emmajg]

the feloow wizard think that an APN maybe missing you may only have WAP and not INTERNET it can be checked just need mobile number not sure you can get this to me.

[AJ145]

Emma - I checked the APN for the 3g connection, it does have internet specified, though I guess something may need to be set on the account?

It seems PM/Email is blocked on this forum - any ideas how I can get in touch?

Thanks

[emmajg]

i think you've just emailed me :)

[emmajg]

I've had a look both wap and internet apn are on the account and at network level. I'll see what I can do this end.

[emmajg]

right what software are you usin that needs to use a different port? My feloow wizards need more info. :confused:

[Homer J]

I have no problems using the internet apn on other ports, with the 120MB package.

Suggest you check your firewall settings.

[Homer J]

Good news, the £7.50 pack is now "unlimited".

Bad news, "unlimited" means 500MB per month.

[old bill]

Good news, the £7.50 pack is now "unlimited".

Bad news, "unlimited" means 500MB per month.

Its a FUP. They are not going to start charging you as soon as you hit 500mb. If you go over 500mb every month they will contact you and ask you cut down. If its just a one of ,say you use 600mb one month then you will be ok.

[hockeyshooter]

Its about time the Advertising Standards Agency jumped on this sharp practice. Its either unlimited or it isn't - no such thing as "slightly unlimited", or "a little bit unlimited".

Chris.

[aquafortis]

Its about time the Advertising Standards Agency jumped on this sharp practice. Its either unlimited or it isn't - no such thing as "slightly unlimited", or "a little bit unlimited".

Chris.


If anyone actually reads their contracts fully it will state subject to fair usage policy, if you do not agree to the terms simply do not sign the contract and go elsewhere, people are all to keen on just signing their name without checking the small print.

[Richdog]

If anyone actually reads their contracts fully it will state subject to fair usage policy, if you do not agree to the terms simply do not sign the contract and go elsewhere, people are all to keen on just signing their name without checking the small print.

Doesn't make a difference what their T&C state, the use of the word "unlimited" is clearly completely misleading. Unlimited implies... yep you guessed it... no limit. 500MB is nothing of the sort, and it's about time the word was only used with justification. Watchdogs have been complaining about this for months with the furor over ISP's claiming "unlimited" use and then having the most ridiculously strict FUP's... Tiscali being a prime example.

[aquafortis]

Yes watchdogs have been complaing for months about the so called definition of unlimited usage isps and mobile networkls claim to offer, but we as customers should realise there has to be a limit of somekind. As technology develops speeds get faster and customers demand more but who pays in the end? Some customers only use the internet for e-mail and viewing the occasional webpage but others download tv shows non stop which effects the performance of any network ie slowing it down so much even those low users suffer. I think the word unlimited will never disappear as i feel the regulators such as OFCOM tend to take a back seat and lets isps regulate themselves unless they are bordering on illegal activities.

[Homer J]

Its about time the Advertising Standards Agency jumped on this sharp practice. Its either unlimited or it isn't - no such thing as "slightly unlimited", or "a little bit unlimited".


It's already been investigated and they came down in the ISPs side, as long as the FUP is pointed out then "unlimited" does not need to be unlimited.

[DonDino]

In most advertisements the FUP is NOT pointed out, all you see is the word 'Unlimited', which means without any limits. That's clear enough and it doesn't take arguments of the sort 'there has to be some limit, data is expensive' etc.

If it is 500mb, then the advert should read 500mb, period.

As for Vodafone, I know this thread is a bit old and they may have yet again changed their mobile data tariffs, but I was surprised to see Vodafone staff saying that their mobile tariffs do allow using the mobile as a modem, and video and audio streaming, but not VoIP or messaging!

A clear admission that 'we don't want you to use any services for free that we can bill you for on our network'. Thankfully O2 at least is not as paranoid and allow chatting. They also don't bother much about VoIP, even though they do include it as a no-no in their T&Cs.

[strikeforce]

In most advertisements the FUP is NOT pointed out, all you see is the word 'Unlimited', which means without any limits. That's clear enough and it doesn't take arguments of the sort 'there has to be some limit, data is expensive' etc.

If it is 500mb, then the advert should read 500mb, period.

As for Vodafone, I know this thread is a bit old and they may have yet again changed their mobile data tariffs, but I was surprised to see Vodafone staff saying that their mobile tariffs do allow using the mobile as a modem, and video and audio streaming, but not VoIP or messaging!

A clear admission that 'we don't want you to use any services for free that we can bill you for on our network'. Thankfully O2 at least is not as paranoid and allow chatting. They also don't bother much about VoIP, even though they do include it as a no-no in their T&Cs.

I think you'll find that o2's T&Cs also prevent you from using messenger & VOIP, Vodafone don't seem to enforce the messenger restrictions as they link to Windows Live Messenger and Yahoo from Vodafone Live.

[DonDino]

O2 don't mention messengers in their T&Cs, they only mention VoIP, but they don't enforce it either, for which I am very grateful to them!

Besides, from a profitability point of view, they wouldn't earn anything if they did enforce a VoIP ban. For outgoing calls, nowadays it's dead cheap to get a local real phone number to use as a personal VoIP gateway (Skype, Callcentric, RebTel, Truphone, these and many more companies offer that), so if VoIP was completely blocked, mobile networks would still not get international calls routed through them.

In addition, VoIP traffic is nowhere near as data-intensive as, for example, emailing large 5-megapixel photos, listening and watching to radio and videos and downloading apps everyday, so the argument of disallowing VoIP on the grounds of data-intensive use is also moot.

That's probably why it's in their T&Cs but they are not strictly enforcing it; they want to keep their options open but at they same time they are mature enough to realise it doesn't cause a great deal of loss or strain on their network any more.

[pctech]

O2 don't mention messengers in their T&Cs, they only mention VoIP, but they don't enforce it either, for which I am very grateful to them!

Besides, from a profitability point of view, they wouldn't earn anything if they did enforce a VoIP ban. For outgoing calls, nowadays it's dead cheap to get a local real phone number to use as a personal VoIP gateway (Skype, Callcentric, RebTel, Truphone, these and many more companies offer that), so if VoIP was completely blocked, mobile networks would still not get international calls routed through them.

In addition, VoIP traffic is nowhere near as data-intensive as, for example, emailing large 5-megapixel photos, listening and watching to radio and videos and downloading apps everyday, so the argument of disallowing VoIP on the grounds of data-intensive use is also moot.

That's probably why it's in their T&Cs but they are not strictly enforcing it; they want to keep their options open but at they same time they are mature enough to realise it doesn't cause a great deal of loss or strain on their network any more.

Any network, whether its mobile or fixed will allow activity that generates revenue (video downloads, metered data use) as this is obvious business sense, this money is then divied into running costs and profit.

FUPs came about because there is a certain section that constantly download and upload via programs such as P2P (put aside the legal stuff about this though for a moment)

Now I don't agree with speed thorttling but on a shared infrasture natural contention will always occur and this is particularly true of mobile networks as each cell has a finite number of channels and codes it can use) and then you come to the backhaul.

Contention will always reduce speed as you cannot go against the laws of physics (well not yet anyway)

If you allowed people to send and receive as much data as they liked and to kepp their connections constantly sending and receiving data then the network would grind to a halt because the resource would be exhausted at one section or another.

It is not possible to have network rules set in stone because it all depends on the network load in the area at that particular time combines with thet networks capacity to handle data so for example 20 users in an area streaming top gear on iPlayer would not be acceptable and so the system would implement measures automatically to ensure that space was available for telephone calls and network operations staff may impose limits/charges on someone found to be downloading 5GB a day as an exmaple.

I think you'll find that conservaitve estimates are quoted in FUPs simply because the operator does not know the level of demand at a certain time of day and this is therefore to legally cover their rear ends, if the network is quiet they are probably far more lenient but if its busy they may enforce it more aggressively, the art of good network management is being proactive.

In the same way with fixed broadband, ISPs have had to impose caps so that they can bill for usage to cover their costs and develop their network to cope with demand.

Large companies may have dedicated fibre links/leased lines and as these are dedicated they are not subject to restrctions but they pay a lot more per month/year than a consumer does but this would not be possible with a mobile network.

Though in some instances for large coporate accounts I've read that mobile networks have set up a dedicated base station installation on site to cope with demand.

[DonDino]

This is an excellent summary of the issues around contention and bandwidth management and I totally agree with it!

But it still doesn't enable companies to use one word ('unlimited') to mean its opposite ('limited') - how far off from flat-out lying is this?

Based on the issues pctech presents above, any ISP could charge a premium, however steep they deem appropriate, for a truly unlimited service. They could advertise it as unlimited, which it truly would be, and charge whatever they like. Then people who really need this kind of limitless connection, or who want it and can afford it, would be welcome to subscribe to and pay for it.

Then the standard services for normal users can ditch the misleading and unnecessary 'unlimited' from their title, if the majority of users who will subscribe to them won't really need that much data anyway.

Otherwise, linguistically (i.e. in real life) it is and will remain a lie to advertise one thing and offer another.
Besides, all those people mentioned above that need or want 'unlimited' already know the FUP-farse and they won't sign up with any fake-unlimited ISP (as I didn't) but will chase up the true unlimited ones, however few there may remain out there.

[pctech]

The point I was trying to make is that you cannot define unlimited.

FUPs are there to allow providers to take action against people that hammer their connection by hosting P2P server applications and the like which do reduce network capacity because of the constant stream of data which I believe where initally the target of these policies.

However appkications such as iPlayer (which should offer access to the BBC archives in my view rather than us having to pay again to buy stuff on DVD) have put additional strain on providers' networks and so they have had to invest in additional bandwidth which has put a strain on their margins and in the current financial climate customers will not tolerate huge rises and will go for the cheapest providers so what is a network operations manager to do to keep costs down and profit up? pursue those that are taking the piss.

[DonDino]

Unlimited
–adjective
1. not limited; unrestricted; unconfined: unlimited trade.
2. boundless; infinite; vast: the unlimited skies.
3. without any qualification or exception; unconditional.


Taken from dictionary.com, they can define it just fine ;)
It's just a word and anyone can define it.

If they want to use it, they have to use it for what it means. If they have concerns over people hammering the connections etc, then they shouldn't give them an 'unlimited' product in the first place, or they should charge a premium for an 'unlimited' product and keep the low-priced services under a different, more appropriate name.


additional bandwidth which has put a strain on their margins

Solved by charging more for products that allow people to use that additional bandwidth.


so what is a network operations manager to do to keep costs down and profit up?

There are many ways to control costs and let profit work its way up, but misleading advertising is not how I run my business ;)

[strikeforce]

Solved by charging more for products that allow people to use that additional bandwidth.


There are many ways to control costs and let profit work its way up, but misleading advertising is not how I run my business ;)

99% of people don't want to pay more than a fiver for browsing the net on their handsets so why should they put the price up? if you need more bandwidth then buy a mobile broadband price plan.

Also they can define it as unlimited as they are not charging you if you go over the FUP from time to time, it's only going to be enforced for the users that are abusing it.

I'd say the way the networks run their business is pretty good considering their profits...

[DonDino]

99% of people don't want to pay more than a fiver for browsing the net on their handsets so why should they put the price up? if you need more bandwidth then buy a mobile broadband price plan.


There you go, you said it yourself.
Of course 99% of people would only pay up to a fiver, and of course 99% of people would only do a little browsing, emailing and watching the odd video from time to time, so an 'unlimited' service is neither required nor warranted for this slice of the market.

To rephrase your words (please correct me if I am not rephrasing but paraphrasing), if one wants more bandwidth/data, then one should pay more for it ;)

[pctech]

What would you call these limited plans then.

The 1GB Plan, 3GB Plan?

I think one of the mobile ops reps made a good point on here, it is a fair usage policy, not a cap, I'm sure if you went over it once in a while there would not be an issue, the issue would arise if you kept doing it.


And I say again, it's down to the nature of the teaffic, I doubt browsing the web would get you into bother but excessive streaming might.