T-Mobile Web 'n' Walk Acceptable Use Policy [Archive] - 3G forum : your 3G community and resource.

DistortedVision

07-05-2007, 04:28 PM

I was wondering if anyone can help me identify what's considered acceptable and what's unacceptable use. I've put what I'm guessing and the ones I'm unsure about so correct me if I'm wrong:

1. Video Centre: Reuters & Google Mobile etc - ACCEPTABLE
2. Podcasting: Downloading podcasts with Nokia's software - UNSURE
3. Streaming: Radio stations using Real player - UNSURE
4. Media Streaming: Using Orb - UNACCEPTABLE
5. Using mobile as a modem to connect to laptop - UNACCEPTABLE
6. VoIP using SIP - UNSURE

bjh_101

07-05-2007, 05:44 PM

Web n Walk £7.50:

1. Video Centre: Reuters & Google Mobile etc - ACCEPTABLE
2. Podcasting: Downloading podcasts with Nokia's software - ACCEPTABLE
3. Streaming: Radio stations using Real player - ACCEPTABLE
4. Media Streaming: Using Orb - ACCEPTABLE
5. Using mobile as a modem to connect to laptop - UNACCEPTABLE
6. VoIP using SIP - UNACCEPTABLE
7. Instant messaging - UNACCEPTABLE
8. Peer to Peer filesharing - UNACCEPTABLE

For web and walk plus (as above except):

5. Using mobile as a modem to connect to laptop - ACCEPTABLE
7. Instant messaging - ACCEPTABLE
8. Peer to Peer filesharing - ACCEPTABLE

For web and walk max - all allowed.

I have taken this from the current web & walk t&c here:
http://www.t-mobile.co.uk/personal/pages.do/orphans/fairuse?WT.mc_id=fairuse&deeplink=fairuse

DistortedVision

07-05-2007, 06:11 PM

Ah thanks.

Interesting that media streaming is allowed but Instant Messaging isn't. Surely the former uses much more bandwidth. Is it possible to upgrade to Web 'n' Walk plus or max from Flext 35 Web 'n' Walk. How much are they?

bjh_101

07-05-2007, 06:17 PM

Ah thanks.

Interesting that media streaming is allowed but Instant Messaging isn't. Surely the former uses much more bandwidth.

I think it is more protecting text revenue rather than a bandwidth issue.

DistortedVision

07-05-2007, 06:52 PM

Oops..I've already used VoIP on mine! I'm surprised they didn't remove SIP from the firmware from phones like Orange and Vodafone have done, if they really care about VoIP calls.

I better be careful with downloading podcasts - at around 15Mb each they soon eat into that 1Gb allowance.

This article reckons that light IM usage is allowed on £7.50 Web 'n' Walk:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/09/29/tmobile_voip_tariff/

How do I check / reset the data counter for T-Mobile Internet Access Point?

Do you think you can get away with light VoIP usage without a warning from T-Mobile?
Has anyone had a warning for VoIP usage or going over their 1Gb allowance? Obviously if they do warn me about it I'll either ask if I can upgrade my W 'n' W or desist with VoIP.

DistortedVision

07-05-2007, 07:00 PM

VoIP is allowed on Web 'n' Walk Plus according to CPW's website:

http://www.carphonewarehouse.com/commerce/servlet/gben-server-PageServer?ARTICLE=STATIC.TMOBNETWORK.MAIN.WEBNWAL K

This is false advertising surely!

deebee01

09-05-2007, 05:44 PM

Its all great to say its unacceptable, but HOW do tmobile enforce this, as if everything is going through port 80 and your not battering it, they cant see whats happening..... can they ?

DistortedVision

09-05-2007, 10:01 PM

Its all great to say its unacceptable, but HOW do tmobile enforce this, as if everything is going through port 80 and your not battering it, they cant see whats happening..... can they ?

How do you configure your applications in your N95 to use port 80. Unless you're talking about using the N95 as a modem with a laptop. If this is the case then I wasn't talking about that. Although that itself is unacceptable use on W'n'W £7.50.

bjh_101

09-05-2007, 10:13 PM

Well personally if I was you I wouldn't worry about it. They are not going to know, and if they get suspicious they will just warn you.

deebee01

10-05-2007, 02:03 AM

How do you configure your applications in your N95 to use port 80. Unless you're talking about using the N95 as a modem with a laptop. If this is the case then I wasn't talking about that. Although that itself is unacceptable use on W'n'W £7.50.

ello mate, not having a pop, meant it as someone who "uses" it in a unacceptable manner if you get me.

wondering how they monitor it all and enforce the restriction, surely if ur under the radar its all good and youll only get done if u take the p1ss

DistortedVision

10-05-2007, 02:22 AM

Yeah I'm thinking the same thing. I think the 1Gb quota is a soft limit. Yeah you're right you'd have to be taking the pish with it to get a warning.

gmspitali

11-05-2007, 02:16 PM

deebee01

11-05-2007, 05:16 PM

I get what your saying, but t&c's are t&c's ;0)

If they cut you off or restricted your service, would you have a problem with that ?

Im curious because your use seems to be flouting the t&c's.........;0)

gmspitali

11-05-2007, 10:09 PM

the t&c's are there for other legal and precautionary reason than to catch the user being naughty. I cant quite recall the exact reason. I know loads of people and there are many people here on the forum who are doing voip, streaming etc on their standard webnwalk. It basically comes down to if you abuse the 1gb limit. If you dont then tmobile wont even bother because to them it makes no difference if you use the 1gb limit for surfing on porn websites or whether you are having cybersex via voip.

rolandrat

30-05-2007, 09:48 AM

Interesting, as I have a phone and datacard, the phone is on £7.50 w&w and the datacard is the old £20+vat tariff, now for some strange reason starting yesterday I can no longer connect to msn/yahoo via datacard in laptop or via im+ on phone. If i disconnect and use wireless or different connection type they are fine.
So t-mob are deffo blocking me at the moment on both my accounts/sims.

snu

31-05-2007, 10:45 AM

T-Mobile started blocking IM traffic about a week

A bit lame if you ask me. They haven't made me more likely to send text messages, they've just made me more likely to take my business elsewhere when my contract is up. Good job, guys!

rolandrat

31-05-2007, 10:53 AM

T-Mobile started blocking IM traffic about a week ago, see http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/forum/showthread.php?p=316331

A bit lame if you ask me. They haven't made me more likely to send text messages, they've just made me more likely to take my business elsewhere when my contract is up. Good job, guys!

Yes I have read various things, but equally some people on w&w pro saying they dont work either. Also my windows live messenger on my wm6 fone is working, but im+ on same fone is not. Also why should they block my datacard business account it might be cheap at £20+vat, but at the time it was the only price to pay, and its not in my t&c's that i cant use IM. As you say t mobile are looking at losing £70 a month worth of business as both contracts are finished in the next few weeks.

snu

31-05-2007, 11:02 AM

If it's not working on plus, pro, or max, then I think you should give them a ring and complain.

[1]Player

31-05-2007, 11:39 AM

definately, the fair use policies should be applying different rules to different tarrifs...

moreati

12-06-2007, 09:50 PM

I just joined T-Mobile on Flext Web n Walk Plus with a Samsung SGH-i600.

Web browsing is great, speed is amazing. I was annoyed to discover that T-Mobile run a transparent proxy which degrades all jpegs. Also, oddly, I can't reach one website at http://schlockmercenary.com for some reason.

I'm having problems with Instant Messaging. I've managed to connect using Windows Live Messenger 8.0 once, every other attempt has failed. The diagnostic usually reports everything OK, although the DNS and Ports test have failed a few times. T-Mobile support have told me that 8.1 is currently unsupported.

Google Talk connects every time, but I cannot connect to my own Jabber server. I've not yet been able to use IRC. SSH works. IMAP works. Authenticated, remote SMTP works.

Is anyone else having trouble with MSN instant messaging on WnW plus?

Alex

rolandrat

16-06-2007, 04:26 PM

Yes I have read various things, but equally some people on w&w pro saying they dont work either. Also my windows live messenger on my wm6 fone is working, but im+ on same fone is not. Also why should they block my datacard business account it might be cheap at £20+vat, but at the time it was the only price to pay, and its not in my t&c's that i cant use IM. As you say t mobile are looking at losing £70 a month worth of business as both contracts are finished in the next few weeks.

Still no better here, one contract already cancelled, just waiting for the other to finish.
Things I have found out through testing - Windows Live Messenger on a HTC 710 (WM6) connects no problem through t-mobile (must be using different ports?), no end of MUNDU/IM+/Agile etc, none work for msn or yahoo, but google talk works fine.
On a laptop connection you can use yahoo messenger by chaging the connection settings to firewall with no proxies and yahoo will connect, cant get msn to work on laptop, VPN is still working so I can get around everything on laptop by VPN to home, but then I have limited download speed.

[1]Player

17-06-2007, 06:37 AM

Which web and walk package do you have? Is it the basic one?

rolandrat

17-06-2007, 08:04 AM

I do have the basic one left, the pure datacard package has been cancelled.
I wouldn't upgrade now as I don't trust tmobile anymore, they shouldnt have blocked my datacard business account, but they did.
I'm moving on. I guess they thought I had a cheap deal getting a datacard account for only £20+vat, trying to force me to upgrade I guess, well they wrong.

snu

17-06-2007, 11:07 AM

I do have the basic one left, the pure datacard package has been cancelled.

Uh, no it hasn't. http://www.t-mobile.co.uk/shop/mobile-phones/internet/laptop/

rolandrat

17-06-2007, 12:11 PM

Uh, no it hasn't. http://www.t-mobile.co.uk/shop/mobile-phones/internet/laptop/

Uh, I was talking about my contracts, not whats available on t-mobile.

[1]Player

17-06-2007, 03:31 PM

And your pure datacard contract... was that also a basic web and walk package?

I have no sympathy for poeple not getting IM on basic web and walk. It's against the T&C's. If you want IM move on the web and walk pro.

snu

17-06-2007, 03:59 PM

Player;321165']I have no sympathy for poeple not getting IM on basic web and walk. It's against the T&C's. If you want IM move on the web and walk pro.

It is against the T&C, but that's pretty lame to be honest.

rolandrat

17-06-2007, 04:00 PM

Player;321165']And your pure datacard contract... was that also a basic web and walk package?

I have no sympathy for poeple not getting IM on basic web and walk. It's against the T&C's. If you want IM move on the web and walk pro.

I wasn't after any sympathy. I can't remember what the t&c's were when I took the datacard contract out, there was only one option £20+vat thats it, the basic/plus/max services have come in since, and you can only get plus and max on the datacard (at a increased £29/£39+vat).
And as I have said, the simple way round it is use VPN, which is easy, and I can't see them blocking VPN ever. Also windows live on WM6 works fine on the basic W&W. They also don't appear to be blocking everyone as I know someone with W&W basic and they can still connect to all messengers. I have also read forums from people who still cant IM with max and plus, so until its black and white I'll carry on cheating the system with VPN.
After all the upgrade to pro is only £4.25 a month hardly bank busting.

[1]Player

17-06-2007, 06:54 PM

VPN isn't available to the vast majority of people.

SMS and voice are the services which pay for the network that provides the internet access.

Without sms and without voice there is no network.

The revenue streams need to be protected.

snu

17-06-2007, 06:57 PM

SMS is not the same as IM, despite what T-Mobile seem to think.

[1]Player

17-06-2007, 08:13 PM

one day it will be, your phone will probably end up being a slightly different msn messenger

snu

17-06-2007, 11:51 PM

Maybe so, but in the here and now the stipulation is stupid and annoying. All it succeeded in doing was piss me off, and make me more likely to migrate to 3 at the end of the contract (for example).

[1]Player

18-06-2007, 07:47 AM

You have to have foresight when writing these policies. Right now, i agree, it isn't the case. But if you gave everyone free IM and it got really big, when you stopped it you could end up irritating half your customers, instead of a few hundred who think they should be getting something for nothing.

snu

19-06-2007, 06:00 PM

Heh, sure. It's "foresight". The same sort of foresight as charging a penny a kb for data?

[1]Player

19-06-2007, 06:36 PM

At the end of the day, if you want a mobile phone, you have to pay for the mobile network, end of story. The fact is that SMS pays for the mobile network, and you have to protect that revenue, or there is no network.

It's a simple fact that you need to live with.

moreati

19-06-2007, 11:23 PM

To those having issues connecting to MSN Instant Messenger or FTP, on WnW plus: If you had WnW plus added as an option, I may have the solution.

T-Mobile resolved my connection issues today, by switching my account from Flext+WnW with a later WnW plus option, to Flext+WnW plus (no options).

I've written more details at:
http://www.moreati.org.uk/blog/2007/06/19/getting-proper-internet-access-on-t-mobile-web-n-walk-plus/

Alex

snu

21-06-2007, 09:21 AM

Player;321749']At the end of the day, if you want a mobile phone, you have to pay for the mobile network, end of story. The fact is that SMS pays for the mobile network, and you have to protect that revenue, or there is no network.

It's a simple fact that you need to live with.

The MNOs make massive profits and generally have atrocious customer service, I'll treat them with the contempt they deserve.

[1]Player

21-06-2007, 01:28 PM

EBITDA might be quite healthy but doesn't tell the whole story.

They're still being crippled by the governments pricing of the 3g licenses.

and actually when i compare my mobile phone bill to my bt bill, more and more do i think bt are ripping me off. I can't believe they still charge per minute for mobile calls. BT doesn't even provide the phones.

snu

21-06-2007, 01:40 PM

Uh, there's a huge imbalance in the termination fees charged by landline providers vs mobile providers. You can hardly blame BT for passing on the cost to their customers. You'll see that the fees for calling UK mobiles are horrendous even through Skype etc because of this.

DaveC

21-06-2007, 05:06 PM

Player;322201']EBITDA might be quite healthy but doesn't tell the whole story.

They're still being crippled by the governments pricing of the 3g licenses.

and actually when i compare my mobile phone bill to my bt bill, more and more do i think bt are ripping me off. I can't believe they still charge per minute for mobile calls. BT doesn't even provide the phones.

And most landines charge between £10.50 and £12.00 per month before you make a call. When you do they have the nerve to charge around 6p connection charge!

However, it was not the government's pricing of 3G that crippled the mobile networks but their own bidding frenzy.

[1]Player

21-06-2007, 07:35 PM

Yes, it's dreadful value for money. When/If t-mobile launch homezones i might ditch BT altogether.

I'd argue that the bidding frenzy was caused by the governments approach to the licenses. :)

Being the only operator without a license would be a kiss of death.

gmspitali

05-07-2007, 05:36 PM

hey, as long as Fring works, skype, msn, IM then and I am not being charged for it....well I dont care. Thats instant messaging and voip there.

fdxd

21-07-2007, 12:39 AM

SMS is not the same as IM, despite what T-Mobile seem to think.

Exactly. Its a terrible move by T-Mobile regardless of what reason they have. IM on phones are still to load software and too limited.

snu

21-07-2007, 11:46 AM

I wonder if they expect you to have w'n'w Plus to use the IM functionality of their Sidekick 3, which they finally just released in the UK... A year after the US...

Neil McRae

22-07-2007, 10:11 AM

Throttle

04-09-2007, 05:15 PM

I can use Msn live on my N95 though tbh its extremley rare i bother and dont see it effecting how much Sms are used by people :rolleyes:

I would like to use my Nokia 770 though with my N95 WnW but no doubt my 770 would be refered to as Laptop i bet.

Has anyone ever had any warning from T-mobile when using Phone connection for internet use on a laptop as tbh id only use my 770 for 10mins on dinner at work or on holiday tbh so i wouldnt plan on file sharing or any major use of it.

DaveC

04-09-2007, 05:33 PM

Have to admit I use it occasionally when I am away in the country. Usually it is just email and a bit of web stuff like moderating this forum:laugh:

elsandalos

17-10-2007, 11:17 AM

interestingly I can still use MSN from my phone.

I seem to remember WnW when it was first released had no options, it was just WnW, I think they then revised it to limit IM/VoIP etc. Could it be some contracts have no limitations?

Has anyone actually had a warning from Tmobile?

I'm in the same boat - signed up when WnW was brand new with no variants and IM used to work fine. Out come the premium options and suddenly i can't connect to IM anymore. Rather poor to pull the rug from under existing customers like that, moving the goalposts ...

El.

hitchiker13

18-10-2007, 09:39 PM

Quick (noob) question :

Moving into UK from the US ( I know you are rollin eyes ), but still...

In US we have data plan aka w'n'w, but still manage to flout and use the phone as a modem, no special terms required, never caught as well - tho t'&c' state phone cannot be used as a modem.

If I were to take plain w'n'w (NOT w'n'w Plus), how is T-Mo able to detect/differentiate from a standalone phone or a phone connected to a laptop. Both demand data over 8080 ports (http browsing only).

So is the t'&c' floutable in UK too? Any body doing that?

I ask this because they have special1 plans out here, explicitly stating 'use your phone as a modem'.

TIA
HH

Neil McRae

23-10-2007, 12:39 PM

no they can't tell.

I use mine as a modem all the time.

Lord Lucan

24-10-2007, 12:54 AM

no they can't tell.

I use mine as a modem all the time.

They can when data triffic is rapid.The flow of data is slow on the actual phone as opposed to used as modem or using a separate modem.
If they take any action or let the user off is upto them. You may getaway sometimes but it is wise to use to fecility only when you have to.Then it wont be too worriying.

Neil McRae

24-10-2007, 08:48 AM

sorry dood but thats BS.

Suppose you use an old laptop? the Tytn for 3G HSDPA is very fast. Having looked at dump of the data flowing out of the laptop into T Mobile there is no way that they can tell what you are using it for.

Lord Lucan

24-10-2007, 02:55 PM

I suppose they can by the browser you are using.If they dont charge than good luck.

[1]Player

24-10-2007, 03:12 PM

If you started playing CS or WoW then it would be fairly obvious. I dread to think of the latency if you were to do that though.

dragon2611

27-10-2007, 01:42 PM

Player;348928']If you started playing CS or WoW then it would be fairly obvious. I dread to think of the latency if you were to do that though.

I did think of trying doing something like that on my WNW+

If i'm in HSDPA coverage I can ping bbc in under 200ms which i rekon would make WOW playable with that sort of ping, but I don't play it anymore but i've played it on all manner of connections in the pass including dialup and had pings in the 800's and still managed to play.

Its out of the question on GPRS though where if I ping bbc.co.uk the roundtrip can take 2000ms with lots of packetloss (Although did have an absolutely marginal signal at the time)

fil

08-01-2008, 02:37 PM

are people syill having msm issues then?

as ive been on the w&w 7.50 deal since day one 1st april 06 wernt it?
im on my third device, vario 1, 2 and now a 3 and have experianced issues with msm but only for the odd day or too, ive allways belived its a network problem, rather than the t-mob blocking it.

skype never had an issue,

use opera mini brouser most days and msm everyday.

dragon2611

08-01-2008, 02:49 PM